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ROBONZO: This episode of The Unstarving Musician is sponsored by Liner Notes.

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ROBONZO: Welcome to The Unstarving Musician.

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ROBONZO: I’m Rabonzo, your host.

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ROBONZO: This is my podcast.

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ROBONZO: How are you?

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ROBONZO: Where are you?

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ROBONZO: What are you wearing?

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ROBONZO: What am I wearing?

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ROBONZO: The Unstarving Musician, as you may know, is a podcast where I speak with independent musicians, music industry folks, and lately creatives of non-musical disciplines to explore the creative journey, the business behind music, creativity, and more.

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ROBONZO: This episode is dropping a little later in the day than usual.

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ROBONZO: I hope that’s okay with you.

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ROBONZO: But today, I sit down with three-time guest Bree Noble.

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ROBONZO: Bree is a musician and music industry professional who has been podcasting for over a decade and has built multiple successful shows, including Women of Substance, Female Entrepreneur Musician, and now the Profitable Musician Show.

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ROBONZO: What makes Bree’s story particularly compelling is how she transformed from a touring musician into a podcasting powerhouse, going from recording shows at her kitchen table while the kids were at school to becoming a recognized thought leader who’s been featured in Forbes and won podcasting awards.

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ROBONZO: We discussed the realities of podcast consistency, the technical hurdles she’s overcome, and how she’s leveraging AI tools like Cast Magic to streamline her workflow.

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ROBONZO: Bree shares candid new podcaster insights about front-loading episodes and pre-planning interview questions.

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ROBONZO: She also talks about why episode swaps and collaboration episodes are working so well for her and other podcasters.

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ROBONZO: Whether you’re a musician considering podcasting as another creative outlet or you’re an independent artist working to strengthen relationships with your existing audience, this conversation reveals the practical strategies from someone who has navigated every stage of podcast growth.

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ROBONZO: Starting a podcast can feel overwhelming.

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ROBONZO: There are technical considerations and like with any content medium consistency requirements.

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ROBONZO: This is why Bree’s Journey is so inspiring and instructive.

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ROBONZO: No one finds starting a podcast easy without a comprehensive roadmap.

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ROBONZO: As fate would have it, I’ve created a complete roadmap in a course called Podcast Startup.

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ROBONZO: The course covers everything from equipment selection to testing video with gear you already have.

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ROBONZO: You’ll find details at unstarvingmusician.com/podcaststartup.

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ROBONZO: I will include a link in the show notes for this episode for you to check that out.

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ROBONZO: Now, let’s dive into my conversation with the always insightful Bree Noble.

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ROBONZO: You’ve been podcasting for over 10 years?

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BREE NOBLE: I have.

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BREE NOBLE: It’s 2014, believe it or not.

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ROBONZO: Now, did you rebrand because, let’s see, I think it was Female Entrepreneur Musician.

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ROBONZO: I hope I got that right.

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ROBONZO: But it looks like Profitable Musician Show is not a name I was familiar with in the early days.

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ROBONZO: Is that right?

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BREE NOBLE: That’s right.

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BREE NOBLE: So Female Entrepreneur Musician was my podcast that I started in 2015.

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BREE NOBLE: And because I had also been doing the Women of Substance podcast, and so I was, you know, focusing on females, elevating females in the industry.

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BREE NOBLE: So why not, you know, speak specifically to them?

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BREE NOBLE: So that’s what I did.

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BREE NOBLE: Then in 2020, when I kind of rebranded as Profitable Musician after doing a couple of Profitable Musician summits and really focusing on helping musicians make money, that’s when I launched that other podcast, because I felt like it was very timely during the pandemic.

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BREE NOBLE: Like, how can we make money without being able to gig, or traditional gig?

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ROBONZO: Yeah.

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ROBONZO: Yeah.

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ROBONZO: Okay.

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ROBONZO: So is there just one now?

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BREE NOBLE: Yeah.

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ROBONZO: Okay.

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BREE NOBLE: Well, kind of.

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BREE NOBLE: So actually, I have both feeds.

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BREE NOBLE: So they both exist in the world, and they’re both named different things, but it’s the same episodes.

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ROBONZO: Oh, okay.

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ROBONZO: Yeah.

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BREE NOBLE: It’s kind of confusing.

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ROBONZO: Because you had the established brand, you went ahead and kept them both?

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BREE NOBLE: Yeah.

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BREE NOBLE: And it’s the feed.

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BREE NOBLE: You can’t transfer the feed.

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BREE NOBLE: You know, so it’s like, I have all these legacy listeners that I don’t want to lose.

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ROBONZO: I understand.

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ROBONZO: Yeah.

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ROBONZO: I had never thought about that.

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ROBONZO: And then, just to give people context, you also had, does the streaming radio show predate any of the podcasts?

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BREE NOBLE: Yeah.

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BREE NOBLE: So, Women of Substance was a radio show first.

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BREE NOBLE: It started in 2007.

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ROBONZO: Wow.

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BREE NOBLE: Yeah.

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BREE NOBLE: It was, I wasn’t really talking on there.

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BREE NOBLE: It was more, it was just my music taste as far as label artists and indie artists.

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BREE NOBLE: And I was like soliciting for more indie artists to come on the show.

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BREE NOBLE: And I wanted to like have them side by side, you know?

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BREE NOBLE: And then I just saw where things were going.

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BREE NOBLE: Like podcasting was more popular.

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BREE NOBLE: It was growing.

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BREE NOBLE: Online radio wasn’t really growing.

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ROBONZO: Are you still digging podcasting after all?

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ROBONZO: I mean, you’ve been through…

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BREE NOBLE: I am so digging it.

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BREE NOBLE: I love it.

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ROBONZO: Oh, good.

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ROBONZO: Good.

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ROBONZO: You know, you’ve really been through, I mean, we could call you an OG, right?

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ROBONZO: You went from streaming radio to early podcasting.

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ROBONZO: Now, was 2015 though, did you start actually podcasting before then?

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BREE NOBLE: So 2014 is when I moved the online radio station to the podcast.

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BREE NOBLE: So Women of Substance started in about fall 2014.

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BREE NOBLE: I started podcasting and that was fun because then I got to talk.

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BREE NOBLE: Like I wasn’t really talking on the radio thing.

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BREE NOBLE: Now I got to introduce the songs and say a little bit about each artist, which was fun.

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BREE NOBLE: And I was just picking the indie ones at that point because I was still playing label artists because there was a way with the radio station to have it.

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BREE NOBLE: So you’re dealing with the royalties and all that stuff.

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BREE NOBLE: Podcasting is different, right?

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BREE NOBLE: I have to have the permission of everybody.

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BREE NOBLE: So I was only doing the indies and I think I kept them both going until 2017.

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BREE NOBLE: And then I shut down the radio station because I was selling ads on both.

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BREE NOBLE: So it was cool because they got to have their ad on both the podcast as it was growing and then the radio station.

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ROBONZO: That’s cool.

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ROBONZO: Are you still featuring music with permission on the podcast or have you gotten away from that by chance?

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BREE NOBLE: So we’re only featuring indie artists.

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BREE NOBLE: So anyone that submits to us through the different channels we have, like SubmitHub and Groover and Broadjam and directly on our website, we ask them to all give us permission.

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BREE NOBLE: Basically, the trade is we’re giving you a promotion and you’re letting us play your song.

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BREE NOBLE: Trust me, we’re not making any money off of it.

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ROBONZO: Right.

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BREE NOBLE: In fact, it’s costing us quite a bit to create the podcast, but it’s a passion.

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ROBONZO: Yeah.

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ROBONZO: I have just gotten away from featuring any music I was doing, kind of like you’re doing permission based and people had new stuff, indie artists, but I think maybe what really made me decide to stop was Spotify because I haven’t had any problems that I know of.

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ROBONZO: I have pulled music from some episodes, but I just haven’t made the time to go through all of them.

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ROBONZO: I don’t have like a gazillion that have music, but quite a few.

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ROBONZO: I thought, what are the chances Spotify just like sees those and maybe they know they exist, but it’s not in their catalog or they’re like, no.

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BREE NOBLE: I’d say the chances are high.

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BREE NOBLE: We are actually not on Spotify right now.

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BREE NOBLE: We got pulled in 2019, I think it even was.

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ROBONZO: For featuring music?

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BREE NOBLE: From having, so the Women of Substance Podcast does not exist on Spotify anymore.

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BREE NOBLE: We are on Apple, we were on Google and all that as they had podcasts.

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ROBONZO: Basically everywhere but Spotify?

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BREE NOBLE: Yes, everywhere but Spotify.

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BREE NOBLE: We were hoping to be able to get back on there.

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BREE NOBLE: If we were working with a company to help us prove that we have permission and be able to get back on Spotify.

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BREE NOBLE: But yeah, they find it to be too much of a competitor with their playlists.

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ROBONZO: Sure.

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ROBONZO: Yeah, that is exactly what I’ve been worried about.

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ROBONZO: So I’m just like, I’m going to just not do it anymore.

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ROBONZO: But I do for whatever reason they haven’t flagged me that I know of.

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ROBONZO: But I assume they notify you even if it’s just on an episode basis.

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BREE NOBLE: I think they do.

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BREE NOBLE: But if you got flagged a few times, they would just shut you down.

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BREE NOBLE: So yeah, I don’t play any music on the Female Entrepreneur Musician or Profitable Musician at all.

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BREE NOBLE: We’re just talking about music and musicians, but not using any music.

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ROBONZO: Okay.

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ROBONZO: Good to know.

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ROBONZO: That was a lot of background, a lot of that for me.

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ROBONZO: But the music thing is interesting.

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ROBONZO: I still run it.

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ROBONZO: Well, it’s been a little while, but I have somewhat recently run into podcasters who are playing music willy nilly and don’t seem to understand what the ramifications can be.

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BREE NOBLE: We have an opening song and a closing song, but that’s by permitting.

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BREE NOBLE: We specifically say on there by permission by this artist and we give their website and stuff.

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ROBONZO: Yeah, that’s cool.

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ROBONZO: Now, for you, I guess, as you mentioned, starting a podcast was watching the direction of things.

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ROBONZO: I have been curious, well, maybe you’re not that special of a case, but you’re providing a lot of services to musicians, maybe still doing mentoring, you’ve done some courses, profitable musician summit in the past and those kind of things.

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ROBONZO: When you…

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ROBONZO: What was your deciding factor to go into podcasting outside of…

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ROBONZO: It was just kind of the direction things were going from streaming.

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ROBONZO: Was there either a musician, like, breathe a musician focus, or was there a business focus, or was it some kind of hybrid?

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BREE NOBLE: Well, as I said before, for the Women of Substance, it was, I want more exposure for these artists, and I think that podcasting is the way to go.

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BREE NOBLE: That’s going to be the growing field, so that’s why I did that, and also offering them advertising opportunities.

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BREE NOBLE: So artists sponsor our podcasts, and some other music companies and stuff sponsor them, so they can get exposure, and they could do that on the radio station, but I just wanted them to get as much exposure as possible, so podcasting was the way to go.

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BREE NOBLE: As far as why I started the Female Entrepreneur Musician in 2015, it was to connect with my perfect customers.

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BREE NOBLE: You know, I was about to start the Female Musician Academy, and I wanted to basically to speak directly to those people, and if I called it Female Entrepreneur Musician, and if anyone thought of themselves at all as, you know, embodying that, they’re going to listen to the show, and those are the people that I wanted.

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BREE NOBLE: Now, weirdly, like, it was a little aspirational, because I think back then, people didn’t think of themselves as entrepreneurs.

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BREE NOBLE: Today, it’s like not a big deal.

00:11:41.360 –> 00:11:45.860
BREE NOBLE: Everyone thinks they are entrepreneurs, I think, or creatives, or something like that.

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BREE NOBLE: Back then, it was like musicians and business, you know, it was separate.

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BREE NOBLE: So, I was kind of trying to, like, be aspirational with that title, but, like, basically draw in the people that were going to get my vibe of, like, I know I need to learn the business stuff, but I don’t know it yet, and I think you can help me.

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ROBONZO: Remembering back to when you first launched the podcast, what was the, like, the single, I laugh because it always makes me think of funny stories, but what was, like, the biggest technical or logistical hurdle that you had to deal with, and did you really have any coming from streaming to podcasting?

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ROBONZO: Was it, it seemed like it would be somewhat different, I guess.

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ROBONZO: Yeah, I guess there were some considerable differences, but what was the big hurdle for you, if any?

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BREE NOBLE: Well, it was very different because I was actually talking, you know, at the streaming, I was just putting together playlists, and I could do that whenever or wherever.

00:12:35.760 –> 00:12:39.220
BREE NOBLE: Back then, I had much younger kids.

00:12:39.220 –> 00:12:42.340
BREE NOBLE: My kids are now 22 and 16.

00:12:42.340 –> 00:12:46.500
BREE NOBLE: So, you know, 10 years ago, they’re very different ages.

00:12:46.500 –> 00:12:49.100
BREE NOBLE: And my desk was in the kitchen.

00:12:49.100 –> 00:12:57.520
BREE NOBLE: So it was very hard to be able to podcast and do my work, like during the day or when people were around.

00:12:58.220 –> 00:13:03.700
BREE NOBLE: So I had it also, I had like a mic all set up down.

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BREE NOBLE: We had this downstairs office that was off the garage.

00:13:07.980 –> 00:13:10.440
BREE NOBLE: And I kind of shared it with my husband.

00:13:10.440 –> 00:13:14.080
BREE NOBLE: But let me tell you, it got very cold in the winter.

00:13:14.080 –> 00:13:15.780
BREE NOBLE: So I’d have to go down there.

00:13:15.780 –> 00:13:17.320
BREE NOBLE: I went, it’s like 40 degrees.

00:13:17.320 –> 00:13:22.120
BREE NOBLE: And we didn’t yet have a mini split heating system down there.

00:13:22.120 –> 00:13:28.280
BREE NOBLE: And, you know, try to podcast when the kids were at school, because then I just didn’t have it set up upstairs.

00:13:28.280 –> 00:13:29.980
BREE NOBLE: I only had one, like, really nice mic.

00:13:29.980 –> 00:13:32.060
BREE NOBLE: So it was all set up down there.

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BREE NOBLE: Or I’d do it at night.

00:13:33.220 –> 00:13:36.080
BREE NOBLE: Or early in the morning, sometimes I’d go down there and do it.

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BREE NOBLE: So it was just, it was hard to find the right times to do the podcasting and get a rhythm for sure.

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BREE NOBLE: Because when I released The Women of Substance at first, it was three days a week, maybe five days a week.

00:13:53.160 –> 00:13:55.000
BREE NOBLE: I think we were five days a week for a while.

00:13:55.720 –> 00:13:59.100
BREE NOBLE: Like I was like, John Lee Dumas was my hero.

00:13:59.100 –> 00:14:02.080
BREE NOBLE: He used to podcast every day, five days a week.

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BREE NOBLE: I’m like, I can do that.

00:14:03.180 –> 00:14:07.020
BREE NOBLE: So I had the content, I had this great music.

00:14:07.020 –> 00:14:08.740
BREE NOBLE: So I’m like, I’m going to do five days a week.

00:14:08.740 –> 00:14:14.300
BREE NOBLE: And I did for probably maybe a year and a half to two years.

00:14:14.300 –> 00:14:17.400
BREE NOBLE: I did it five days a week and it was a lot.

00:14:17.400 –> 00:14:21.440
BREE NOBLE: Then I moved it to three days a week, it was much easier to do.

00:14:21.440 –> 00:14:23.660
BREE NOBLE: And then of course, the other podcast was like once a week.

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ROBONZO: Wow, so, I mean, it was really just the life circumstances, the getting in a situation where you had a controlled studio environment, the biggest things for you.

00:14:39.120 –> 00:14:43.180
ROBONZO: And those are, I mean, I guess I’ve heard that many times.

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BREE NOBLE: Yeah, and it was, you know, it’s timing.

00:14:44.900 –> 00:14:50.940
BREE NOBLE: Like I did have seasons where one or one at a time, my kids were homeschooling.

00:14:51.700 –> 00:14:57.820
BREE NOBLE: So sometimes, you know, I couldn’t do it when they were in the school day.

00:14:57.820 –> 00:15:01.720
BREE NOBLE: And I couldn’t do it in the evening when everybody was watching Disney Channel or whatever.

00:15:01.720 –> 00:15:06.060
BREE NOBLE: So I had to go, I had to do it in the mornings or the evenings for a while.

00:15:06.060 –> 00:15:08.600
BREE NOBLE: So that was definitely a big challenge.

00:15:08.600 –> 00:15:09.040
ROBONZO: Man.

00:15:09.040 –> 00:15:13.440
ROBONZO: Yeah, I’m sure that stuff is not terribly uncommon.

00:15:13.480 –> 00:15:19.840
BREE NOBLE: Yeah, no, and anyone that’s a mom or has any kind of family responsibilities knows what I’m talking about.

00:15:19.840 –> 00:15:21.280
ROBONZO: Totally.

00:15:21.280 –> 00:15:30.160
ROBONZO: So what’s the one thing you’d wish you’d known that, yeah, before you started recording the actual podcasts.

00:15:30.160 –> 00:15:39.960
ROBONZO: And I, again, I think of you as so different, you’ve been doing the streaming thing, but like you said, you go from streaming playlists to talking, but yeah, what’s the thing you wish you’d known?

00:15:41.000 –> 00:15:48.380
BREE NOBLE: I think I would have probably like front-loaded more episodes.

00:15:48.380 –> 00:15:57.320
BREE NOBLE: I didn’t know when I started the Profitable Musician in 2020, I knew so much more and I front-loaded that with like five episodes.

00:15:57.320 –> 00:16:04.600
BREE NOBLE: So when I launched it, people could binge, people could really get into it, get them excited enough to want to subscribe.

00:16:06.220 –> 00:16:10.380
BREE NOBLE: And when I started those other ones, I didn’t do that.

00:16:10.380 –> 00:16:12.720
BREE NOBLE: And so I think I would have done that.

00:16:12.900 –> 00:16:17.760
BREE NOBLE: It would have taken the pressure off too because I was new to interviewing.

00:16:17.760 –> 00:16:19.800
BREE NOBLE: Like I was pretty comfortable talking.

00:16:19.800 –> 00:16:23.920
BREE NOBLE: I had always had a lot of practice talking on stage and things like that.

00:16:23.920 –> 00:16:26.340
BREE NOBLE: But interviewing was a little different.

00:16:26.340 –> 00:16:33.500
BREE NOBLE: And I wasn’t as comfortable with asking questions off the cuff like I am now.

00:16:33.500 –> 00:16:35.520
BREE NOBLE: Now I don’t even ever have a script or anything.

00:16:36.120 –> 00:16:45.020
BREE NOBLE: But back then, you know, I had a script and then it, you know, I was just like so worried about what I was going to say and how I was going to say it.

00:16:45.020 –> 00:16:52.220
BREE NOBLE: And so I think I would have taken the pressure off if I had put a few more in the can before I started.

00:16:52.220 –> 00:16:55.560
ROBONZO: So I did do that when I first started because it was recommended.

00:16:55.620 –> 00:17:03.540
ROBONZO: But did you find, as I did, I don’t know if you were doing just strictly interviews, but I was decided I’m just going to do interviews.

00:17:03.540 –> 00:17:07.560
ROBONZO: As I mentioned before, we started talking about deeply about podcasting.

00:17:07.560 –> 00:17:10.920
ROBONZO: Now I do intersperse some solo episodes.

00:17:10.920 –> 00:17:18.420
ROBONZO: But in the early days, did you have these weeks where you’re stressed that who’s going to be on my podcast next episode?

00:17:19.660 –> 00:17:21.060
BREE NOBLE: Yeah, I did.

00:17:21.780 –> 00:17:37.320
BREE NOBLE: If I didn’t have enough done ahead and then like somebody ghosted me or they had a family emergency, which happens more than you might think, and they can’t show up, that can put the stress on.

00:17:37.320 –> 00:17:41.380
BREE NOBLE: I did do only interviews for a while.

00:17:41.380 –> 00:17:49.980
BREE NOBLE: But I did decide to start doing some solo episodes when I was going to launch something, because I wanted them to hear from me.

00:17:50.320 –> 00:17:55.640
BREE NOBLE: So that was easier because then I could do those on my own time.

00:17:55.640 –> 00:17:59.000
BREE NOBLE: I didn’t have to, because that was the other thing about interviews.

00:17:59.000 –> 00:18:01.860
BREE NOBLE: I have to do it when the other people are available.

00:18:02.960 –> 00:18:10.740
BREE NOBLE: I’m on Pacific time, so that could be a little bit problematic if I need to do it in the evening for people that are on Eastern and that kind of thing.

00:18:10.740 –> 00:18:17.220
BREE NOBLE: So that was the other thing of being a mom while trying to do it, was trying to organize my times with the interview people.

00:18:17.920 –> 00:18:22.960
BREE NOBLE: So once I did my solo episodes, it was much easier to get them done.

00:18:22.960 –> 00:18:28.940
BREE NOBLE: But it was a little more nerve-wracking too because I didn’t, you know, I had to come up with all the content.

00:18:28.940 –> 00:18:41.020
ROBONZO: I found I have only, you know, 300 some episodes in and I guess I published the first one in 2017, so whatever, eight years.

00:18:41.020 –> 00:18:45.420
ROBONZO: Now, I only recently have gotten comfortable doing solo episodes.

00:18:45.420 –> 00:18:53.100
ROBONZO: And I think for me, it was just like, I wasn’t sure I knew enough to be talking on my own.

00:18:53.100 –> 00:19:02.920
ROBONZO: But I think by virtue of the content that I’ve accumulated, it gives me a lot of topic matter to mine.

00:19:03.300 –> 00:19:06.240
ROBONZO: And that’s becoming easier with AI tools as you can imagine.

00:19:06.320 –> 00:19:12.160
ROBONZO: But then also, I think I embrace this idea that I’m learning with you.

00:19:12.160 –> 00:19:14.420
ROBONZO: Like, I have not done a lot of this stuff.

00:19:14.420 –> 00:19:16.640
ROBONZO: I try to say often.

00:19:16.640 –> 00:19:20.880
ROBONZO: So or I’m testing these things, you know, and this is what they’re saying works.

00:19:20.880 –> 00:19:22.580
ROBONZO: So, yeah.

00:19:22.580 –> 00:19:29.600
BREE NOBLE: Yeah, no, that’s a great a great way to do it, because then people aren’t expecting you to be an expert, which is good.

00:19:29.620 –> 00:20:01.760
BREE NOBLE: One thing that really got me out of it was in 2017 when live streaming came into the world, Facebook Live, I forced myself to do a show once a week, and I used it for the podcast a lot of the time, and it was a live recorded live, it was called Indie Interactive, and I was going on every week, I had slides, it was a full on thing where I was teaching a subject and I was interacting with people and stuff.

00:20:02.600 –> 00:20:23.300
BREE NOBLE: And so, you know, that also gave me tons of stuff for the podcast, for me to put on the podcast without having to do interviews, because at that point I was really trying to like build up my connection with the audience, and so I did go through a period where I don’t think I really interviewed very much for a while.

00:20:23.300 –> 00:20:38.760
BREE NOBLE: And then I think I took a break, I did take a break in there, I took a break, I think in like 20, I think when I was doing the summits, you know, it was just so much to do the summits.

00:20:38.760 –> 00:20:39.480
ROBONZO: Yeah.

00:20:39.480 –> 00:20:52.000
BREE NOBLE: And so I took a break from the podcast for a while until I, until the pandemic, and then I was like, oh my gosh, these people need guidance.

00:20:52.000 –> 00:21:00.820
BREE NOBLE: And so I brought the podcast back and it was all about how you can make money, you know, during this economy and, you know, all that stuff.

00:21:00.820 –> 00:21:07.280
BREE NOBLE: Before I even started Profitable Musician, I brought the other podcasts back and just wanted to serve.

00:21:07.280 –> 00:21:10.140
ROBONZO: Yeah, that’s pretty cool.

00:21:10.140 –> 00:21:17.920
ROBONZO: And do you do any, do you still do anything like that where you do those video classes or whatever you called it, workshops?

00:21:18.960 –> 00:21:23.980
BREE NOBLE: I do them inside my membership, the Female Musician Accelerator.

00:21:25.480 –> 00:21:28.020
BREE NOBLE: We have like Q&A coaching calls.

00:21:28.020 –> 00:21:34.020
BREE NOBLE: We have once a month workshops where I teach a particular subject.

00:21:34.020 –> 00:21:34.480
ROBONZO: Cool.

00:21:34.480 –> 00:21:39.420
BREE NOBLE: And I love doing those, but I don’t do live streaming anymore.

00:21:39.420 –> 00:21:40.340
ROBONZO: Yeah.

00:21:40.340 –> 00:21:45.400
BREE NOBLE: Because I feel like I’ve really built up my audience enough that I don’t have to do that.

00:21:46.560 –> 00:21:50.760
BREE NOBLE: And I just, you know, after the pandemic, like people are kind of sick of being online all the time.

00:21:50.760 –> 00:21:53.720
BREE NOBLE: It was very much a cool thing.

00:21:53.800 –> 00:21:56.180
BREE NOBLE: You know, in 2017, when it was new.

00:21:56.180 –> 00:21:57.220
ROBONZO: Sure.

00:21:57.220 –> 00:21:57.580
ROBONZO: Yeah.

00:21:57.760 –> 00:22:05.540
ROBONZO: And I guess now they’re with you online for a very specific purpose, like they signed up for some program or whatever.

00:22:05.540 –> 00:22:08.140
ROBONZO: So, right now, that’s cool.

00:22:08.140 –> 00:22:09.600
ROBONZO: I like it.

00:22:09.600 –> 00:22:20.060
ROBONZO: You mentioned in when we first started talking about doing this episode that we should discuss how podcasting has benefited musicians, which is kind of the theme for my outreach.

00:22:20.160 –> 00:22:28.520
ROBONZO: And can you share the most concrete opportunities or career things that came directly from your podcast?

00:22:28.520 –> 00:22:30.580
BREE NOBLE: There’s some direct and indirect, right?

00:22:30.580 –> 00:22:47.180
BREE NOBLE: So, there’s definitely, I got asked to be part of an article that got put on Forbes, which was cool about women in podcasting, and it’s like fighting the patriarchy or something like that.

00:22:47.180 –> 00:22:55.040
BREE NOBLE: And that’s cool to be able to say that I have had an article on Forbes that I helped write, which is awesome.

00:22:55.040 –> 00:22:58.280
BREE NOBLE: I’ve won a couple interesting awards.

00:22:58.340 –> 00:23:03.680
BREE NOBLE: I won the podcasters paradise, most creative podcast award or something like that.

00:23:03.680 –> 00:23:11.520
BREE NOBLE: So they’re just little things that you can hang your hat on, you can put on your bio and stuff.

00:23:11.900 –> 00:23:16.620
BREE NOBLE: I think that it really does increase your authority.

00:23:17.680 –> 00:23:22.020
BREE NOBLE: You find out that people know about you that you didn’t know of.

00:23:22.020 –> 00:23:23.160
BREE NOBLE: You don’t know of them, right?

00:23:23.160 –> 00:23:31.600
BREE NOBLE: But then I think I was in a group with somebody recently and I was like, oh, I do this and then he was like, oh yeah, I’ve heard of you.

00:23:31.600 –> 00:23:35.620
BREE NOBLE: My students have told me about you or I saw you here or there.

00:23:35.620 –> 00:23:50.140
BREE NOBLE: When you start getting on these, as I think I saw that we were both on this list of top 50 podcasts for musicians or to marketing podcasts or something like that.

00:23:50.140 –> 00:23:53.820
BREE NOBLE: When you get on those lists, that gives you some cred.

00:23:53.820 –> 00:24:11.260
BREE NOBLE: Then I think also for me, it just allowed me to like, it forced me to kind of become a thought leader, think through things on how I want to teach things, how I want to approach things or talk about things from my own perspective.

00:24:11.260 –> 00:24:24.880
BREE NOBLE: Then eventually, having to create content and everything, it helped me to develop my own musician’s profit path method, which eventually became a book and then that just even boosts your credibility.

00:24:25.620 –> 00:24:29.360
BREE NOBLE: You get to become a speaker and all that kind of stuff, right?

00:24:29.360 –> 00:24:35.620
BREE NOBLE: I think one thing is if you’re a podcaster, people know that you can probably be a speaker.

00:24:35.860 –> 00:24:38.540
BREE NOBLE: So that’s also opening doors there.

00:24:40.340 –> 00:24:50.420
ROBONZO: You just reminded me that, so I had a guest who had authored a book about, he was with Forbes, he was on staff with, I guess, forbes.com.

00:24:51.000 –> 00:24:59.960
ROBONZO: He had authored a book about, well, he authored some about different musicians, and it was largely about the ones who are really making it, like the famous people.

00:24:59.960 –> 00:25:14.160
ROBONZO: And then most recently, he had published one, or maybe he’s sub-stacking this one, but now I’m getting foggy, but it’s called We’re All Musicians Now.

00:25:14.160 –> 00:25:20.960
ROBONZO: Just sort of talking about the way the economy’s gone, and the independent sort of artist or thinker.

00:25:20.960 –> 00:25:28.160
ROBONZO: But I think after our first interview, he messaged me and said, Hey, I’m looking for contributors for forbes.com.

00:25:28.160 –> 00:25:29.640
ROBONZO: Would you like to write some articles for us?

00:25:29.640 –> 00:25:31.920
ROBONZO: And I forgot all about that, so that was kind of a neat opportunity.

00:25:31.920 –> 00:25:34.380
ROBONZO: Yeah, I wrote several articles for them.

00:25:34.380 –> 00:25:40.440
BREE NOBLE: Yeah, I think one major thing that it’s allowed me to do is meet other people in the industry.

00:25:40.440 –> 00:25:50.260
BREE NOBLE: I’ve had so many people on my podcast now, hundreds of episodes, and probably done 200 interviews.

00:25:50.500 –> 00:25:55.300
BREE NOBLE: If I look back and count the people that I’ve interviewed.

00:25:55.300 –> 00:26:02.500
BREE NOBLE: And a lot of them, some of them are musicians, but a lot of them are people that work in the industry, like myself.

00:26:02.500 –> 00:26:14.300
BREE NOBLE: And so I’ve met partners and I’ve been able to introduce my audience to what they do and vice versa, and just met people that I’ve worked together.

00:26:14.300 –> 00:26:16.520
BREE NOBLE: Like for example, I’ll give you a really good example.

00:26:16.520 –> 00:26:33.740
BREE NOBLE: So someone who messaged me out of the blue in the very first six months of me having a podcast, and she basically pitched me and she’s like, this is what I do and I have been gigging for 25 years.

00:26:33.740 –> 00:26:35.000
BREE NOBLE: I do it all myself.

00:26:36.340 –> 00:26:37.540
BREE NOBLE: I do all my own booking, etc.

00:26:37.880 –> 00:26:39.460
BREE NOBLE: So I had her on the show.

00:26:39.460 –> 00:26:40.480
BREE NOBLE: She was awesome.

00:26:40.480 –> 00:26:42.180
BREE NOBLE: I love the practical tips.

00:26:42.180 –> 00:26:44.080
BREE NOBLE: She and I really got along.

00:26:44.080 –> 00:26:46.720
BREE NOBLE: We kept in touch over the few years.

00:26:46.720 –> 00:26:51.120
BREE NOBLE: Then I ended up helping her to develop her own course on booking.

00:26:51.120 –> 00:26:55.760
BREE NOBLE: Then I brought her into the Academy as one of the coaches.

00:26:56.260 –> 00:27:00.280
BREE NOBLE: She eventually left that and was doing other things, and then we reconnected recently.

00:27:00.280 –> 00:27:10.260
BREE NOBLE: We’re like, hey, let’s do some podcast episodes of us just talking about stuff that relates to musicians like we are now, but like super casual like we were at a coffee shop and like do a series.

00:27:10.260 –> 00:27:24.200
BREE NOBLE: So now we do it once a month where it’s, you know, Bree and Tara talking about some musical subject, and it’s just easy and fun and all because she messaged me to be someone to be interviewed on my podcast.

00:27:24.200 –> 00:27:25.540
ROBONZO: That’s really cool.

00:27:25.540 –> 00:27:26.260
ROBONZO: That’s really cool.

00:27:26.260 –> 00:27:28.080
ROBONZO: An ongoing relationship and friendship.

00:27:28.120 –> 00:27:28.900
BREE NOBLE: Yeah.

00:27:28.900 –> 00:27:41.380
ROBONZO: I think I probably hear most people that I talked to about podcast and, and you know, these are not just people in music, but they just immediately talk about the people that they’ve met.

00:27:41.380 –> 00:27:43.420
ROBONZO: Has just been fantastic.

00:27:43.420 –> 00:27:45.860
BREE NOBLE: So yeah, people all over the world.

00:27:45.860 –> 00:27:49.140
BREE NOBLE: Like I never would meet these people otherwise.

00:27:49.140 –> 00:27:53.880
ROBONZO: We can both think of how many musicians have don’t podcast, never will.

00:27:53.880 –> 00:27:55.900
ROBONZO: Maybe haven’t thought of it, maybe thought of it, but aren’t doing it.

00:27:55.980 –> 00:28:04.800
ROBONZO: But how can you best talk about how it changed your relationship with your audience compared to other music marketing approaches?

00:28:05.140 –> 00:28:15.180
ROBONZO: You’re a great person to ask that because you’ve done all the things that you have done in marketing yourself as a musician, as a mentor, doing the events and all that.

00:28:15.180 –> 00:28:23.780
ROBONZO: So yeah, how do you see podcasting has changed your relationship that might be of interest to other musicians and actually just created people in general, by the way?

00:28:24.840 –> 00:28:37.980
BREE NOBLE: Yeah, I mean, it just, it really deepens that relationship because they are basically putting you in their ear for hours, you know, like on a regular basis, right?

00:28:37.980 –> 00:28:44.620
BREE NOBLE: I definitely feel like the people that I listen to their podcast every week, I almost have a relationship with them.

00:28:44.620 –> 00:28:48.220
BREE NOBLE: I know that I don’t, you know, but I feel like I know them.

00:28:48.220 –> 00:28:51.280
BREE NOBLE: I feel that it’s just more of like an instant trust.

00:28:51.480 –> 00:29:06.520
BREE NOBLE: If you kind of hear them over time, and you get a sense for if they’re really real, and you know, they also they really know what they’re talking about, like they’re willing to stand up for things that are important to them.

00:29:06.520 –> 00:29:15.860
BREE NOBLE: Those are all things for me that are important in somebody that I want to work with, and that I, you know, I’m just going to like be a champion for, right?

00:29:15.860 –> 00:29:34.020
BREE NOBLE: So even if it’s about promoting your music, like, if I always say, like, if people don’t like you, like the person, then even if they like your music, they probably aren’t going to ever become a champion for it, because there’s no reason to like really get behind it.

00:29:34.020 –> 00:29:35.760
BREE NOBLE: It’s like, yeah, that song’s good.

00:29:35.760 –> 00:29:46.660
BREE NOBLE: But like, no, if you know what this person’s about and their goals and their experience and, you know, you feel attached to them, you’re going to want to put that forward.

00:29:46.780 –> 00:29:49.940
BREE NOBLE: You’re going to want to promote that music if you like it.

00:29:49.940 –> 00:29:53.720
BREE NOBLE: And so I think it’s just really creates that bond.

00:29:53.720 –> 00:30:00.680
BREE NOBLE: And it creates more connection points of like things that we haven’t caught.

00:30:00.680 –> 00:30:03.860
BREE NOBLE: You know, like you were asking me about our cat, right?

00:30:03.860 –> 00:30:04.180
BREE NOBLE: Right?

00:30:04.180 –> 00:30:08.220
BREE NOBLE: Like if you’re a cat lover, you’d be like, oh, she has a kitten.

00:30:08.220 –> 00:30:09.400
BREE NOBLE: That’s so cool.

00:30:09.420 –> 00:30:20.400
BREE NOBLE: You know, and it just in some ways we have to stand out, but we also have to show how we are similar to the people in our audience.

00:30:20.400 –> 00:30:25.560
BREE NOBLE: So they’re going to feel that affinity, like that feel like like they’re at home with you.

00:30:25.560 –> 00:30:26.820
ROBONZO: Yeah, that’s great.

00:30:26.820 –> 00:30:30.720
BREE NOBLE: And podcasting gives you a lot of time to do that.

00:30:30.920 –> 00:30:40.560
ROBONZO: I can relate so much to like the feeling of friendship or bond that you have, even with a lot of these people, that you’ve never had the opportunity to meet in person.

00:30:40.560 –> 00:30:48.640
ROBONZO: But like, and maybe I haven’t talked to them in a really long time, but when I reconnect, it just feels, it sounds corny, but it feels pretty special.

00:30:48.640 –> 00:30:49.640
BREE NOBLE: Yeah.

00:30:49.640 –> 00:30:49.920
BREE NOBLE: Yeah.

00:30:49.920 –> 00:30:57.700
BREE NOBLE: And when you meet people in person that you’ve listened to on a podcast for years, you feel like you’re just picking up the conversation, which is crazy.

00:30:57.700 –> 00:30:58.680
ROBONZO: Totally.

00:30:58.680 –> 00:31:00.140
ROBONZO: It’s really cool.

00:31:01.260 –> 00:31:08.880
ROBONZO: What’s the biggest misconception that you think musicians or other creative people would have about what it takes to maintain a successful podcast?

00:31:10.980 –> 00:31:18.580
BREE NOBLE: I would say, like the consistency that it takes to keep it going.

00:31:20.320 –> 00:31:22.680
BREE NOBLE: It is a bit of a grind sometimes.

00:31:22.680 –> 00:31:33.700
BREE NOBLE: You really have to plan if you’re going to go on vacation for three weeks, like I did this summer, and not want to have to podcast while you’re gone, which I could have, but I didn’t want to.

00:31:33.700 –> 00:31:34.780
BREE NOBLE: You have to plan ahead.

00:31:34.880 –> 00:31:36.760
BREE NOBLE: You have to be able to…

00:31:37.140 –> 00:31:54.680
BREE NOBLE: I hear so many people that are like so excited about the idea of podcasting, and they think that the idea is going to be enough to drive them to do the grunt work.

00:31:54.680 –> 00:32:07.000
BREE NOBLE: And while you can be very excited about your idea, you have to have just a deep-seated desire to make this thing long-term.

00:32:07.000 –> 00:32:10.320
BREE NOBLE: And so you gotta have a plan for that.

00:32:10.320 –> 00:32:13.200
BREE NOBLE: How are you going to be consistent?

00:32:13.200 –> 00:32:20.940
BREE NOBLE: Because I really don’t think that you’re going to build up your audience if you’re not consistent.

00:32:21.820 –> 00:32:26.600
BREE NOBLE: And so, I mean, I think you need to come up with a cadence that you can do.

00:32:26.600 –> 00:32:32.700
BREE NOBLE: You know, my friend Tara, like, she brought her podcast back recently when I approached her and said, let’s do these episodes.

00:32:32.700 –> 00:32:34.240
BREE NOBLE: And you know, she’s like, that’s cool.

00:32:34.240 –> 00:32:35.660
BREE NOBLE: It’ll make things easy for me.

00:32:35.660 –> 00:32:41.860
BREE NOBLE: I’m going to do a few solo episodes, but she’s not pushing herself out of what she can do.

00:32:41.860 –> 00:32:43.440
BREE NOBLE: You know, she’s gigging all the time.

00:32:43.440 –> 00:32:48.200
BREE NOBLE: She’s like, I can only put out a podcast once every two weeks, but I’m going to stick to that.

00:32:48.860 –> 00:32:55.860
BREE NOBLE: And I’m not going to try to push myself beyond that, but I’m going to do that and I’m going to be there for my audience every two weeks.

00:32:55.860 –> 00:32:57.800
BREE NOBLE: And that’s perfect.

00:32:57.800 –> 00:33:06.900
BREE NOBLE: But you can’t, you know, think that, like, like I did in the, in the beginning of Women of Substance, I’m like, I’m going to go five days a week, right?

00:33:06.900 –> 00:33:14.340
BREE NOBLE: And I stuck with that because I, you know, damned if I was going to like give up on that when I said that was what I was going to do.

00:33:14.340 –> 00:33:15.700
BREE NOBLE: I was just like determined.

00:33:16.900 –> 00:33:20.620
BREE NOBLE: And eventually, I was like, this really isn’t necessary.

00:33:20.620 –> 00:33:25.340
BREE NOBLE: I made, I kept the promise to myself, and I did this for like a year and a half.

00:33:25.340 –> 00:33:28.460
BREE NOBLE: It’s not necessary to do it five days a week.

00:33:28.460 –> 00:33:32.480
BREE NOBLE: But, you know, you got to, you got to make a plan and you got to stick to it.

00:33:32.480 –> 00:33:34.780
BREE NOBLE: And so many people don’t do that.

00:33:34.780 –> 00:33:38.980
BREE NOBLE: So many people start something out, they get all excited, they launch.

00:33:38.980 –> 00:33:44.260
BREE NOBLE: You know, I was talking to somebody else who has a podcast, and she’s like, you know, let’s, let’s swap trailers.

00:33:44.320 –> 00:33:52.300
BREE NOBLE: And I’m like, cool, and she’s like, she’s like, yeah, I need new more trailers because all the people that I swap with have podfaded already.

00:33:52.300 –> 00:33:54.240
BREE NOBLE: I’m like, well, don’t worry about me podfading.

00:33:54.240 –> 00:33:56.460
BREE NOBLE: I’ve been around for 10 years.

00:33:56.460 –> 00:34:14.060
ROBONZO: Yeah, every time I hear the numbers, you know, and I’m not good at remembering numbers like this, but the number of podcasts that are out there, but then it gets put in context, like the ones that are actually still podcasting, dramatic difference, you know, the ones that get started and then the ones that just, you know, go away versus one that keep going.

00:34:15.220 –> 00:34:16.420
BREE NOBLE: Yep.

00:34:16.420 –> 00:34:16.980
ROBONZO: Crazy.

00:34:17.160 –> 00:34:19.860
ROBONZO: I can relate to pretty much everything you just said.

00:34:20.640 –> 00:34:31.300
ROBONZO: I’m actually publishing every other week, and I’ve gotten really heavy into, maybe since last time we spoke, into once every other week newsletter.

00:34:31.300 –> 00:34:32.560
BREE NOBLE: That’s great.

00:34:32.560 –> 00:34:32.940
ROBONZO: Thank you.

00:34:33.340 –> 00:34:40.120
ROBONZO: And have expanded that just last week or about a week ago to Substack, which I am.

00:34:40.120 –> 00:34:41.340
BREE NOBLE: Me too.

00:34:41.340 –> 00:34:43.260
BREE NOBLE: So I do two newsletters every week.

00:34:43.260 –> 00:34:51.440
BREE NOBLE: On Wednesday is the Profitable Musician newsletter, and Friday is the Femme Friday newsletter, which is specifically for women, female musicians.

00:34:51.440 –> 00:34:59.100
BREE NOBLE: And so I decided to take that Friday one and put it on Substack as its own branded thing as Femme Music Friday.

00:35:00.220 –> 00:35:09.620
BREE NOBLE: And so just, you know, it’s not a huge following over there yet, because I’m not digging into it, but I’m just seeing if it’s going to be a good discovery platform.

00:35:09.620 –> 00:35:11.000
ROBONZO: That’s cool.

00:35:11.000 –> 00:35:24.760
ROBONZO: Yeah, you know, what’s drawn me to it is I have heard more than once, some both times, or however many times, but somewhat recently, that the community there is like actually good, the community feature.

00:35:24.760 –> 00:35:31.760
ROBONZO: And I knew that it had, I suspected it had some content features built in that were attractive.

00:35:31.760 –> 00:35:38.240
ROBONZO: It’s funny, I’m actually finding, you know, I used to be called ConvertKit, it’s called Kit now.

00:35:38.240 –> 00:35:39.920
BREE NOBLE: Me too, I also use Kit.

00:35:39.920 –> 00:35:44.520
ROBONZO: Well, you probably noticed the same, but they seem to be trying to do their own version of Substack.

00:35:44.520 –> 00:35:51.840
ROBONZO: And just today, I was like, oh, look at that, they have a way for me to put a private podcast up with one of their apps.

00:35:52.060 –> 00:35:54.980
BREE NOBLE: But you can put a private podcast?

00:35:54.980 –> 00:35:56.740
ROBONZO: Yeah, I just saw this today.

00:35:56.740 –> 00:35:57.400
BREE NOBLE: Oh, I know it.

00:35:57.400 –> 00:35:58.440
BREE NOBLE: It’s Hello Audio.

00:35:58.440 –> 00:35:59.820
BREE NOBLE: Yeah, I’m familiar with that.

00:35:59.820 –> 00:36:00.120
ROBONZO: Okay.

00:36:00.120 –> 00:36:01.600
ROBONZO: Yeah, maybe that was the one.

00:36:01.600 –> 00:36:07.000
BREE NOBLE: But anyway, I have not done that, but I do love the idea of a private podcast.

00:36:07.000 –> 00:36:21.900
ROBONZO: Yeah, I mean, you know, to be able to, I was thinking just after publishing my first two posts on Substack, I was thinking, you know, I actually have a very relevant podcast that I could just put a clip of that I haven’t done anywhere else.

00:36:21.900 –> 00:36:23.700
ROBONZO: So that would be kind of a neat little exclusive thing.

00:36:23.700 –> 00:36:25.440
ROBONZO: But yeah, yeah.

00:36:25.440 –> 00:36:26.620
ROBONZO: Yes.

00:36:26.620 –> 00:36:28.600
BREE NOBLE: Well, Substack now has podcasts.

00:36:28.600 –> 00:36:29.820
BREE NOBLE: They now have video.

00:36:29.820 –> 00:36:31.040
BREE NOBLE: They have everything now.

00:36:31.040 –> 00:36:34.280
BREE NOBLE: They’re trying to be like the all in one.

00:36:34.280 –> 00:36:35.300
ROBONZO: Yeah, it’s crazy.

00:36:35.300 –> 00:36:36.840
ROBONZO: It’s crazy.

00:36:36.840 –> 00:36:43.960
ROBONZO: How do you approach networking different through podcasting as a medium, you know, differently than traditional industry networking?

00:36:44.700 –> 00:36:51.420
ROBONZO: And because you clearly have developed a lot of cool relationships within the industry and with other musicians.

00:36:51.420 –> 00:36:56.600
ROBONZO: So how do you see it as different or how do you treat it differently?

00:36:56.600 –> 00:37:01.160
BREE NOBLE: I think it’s a really good gateway to networking with someone.

00:37:01.160 –> 00:37:04.560
BREE NOBLE: I can get a really good sense of whether I’m going to get along with them.

00:37:04.560 –> 00:37:08.540
BREE NOBLE: I like their vibe and all that by interviewing them first.

00:37:08.540 –> 00:37:16.580
BREE NOBLE: You know, before we talk about, oh, let’s do a, you know, a partner launch or let’s, you know, do something together.

00:37:16.580 –> 00:37:20.880
BREE NOBLE: It just lets me know if they’re going to be someone that I want to work with.

00:37:20.880 –> 00:37:24.400
BREE NOBLE: It’s just so much easier to figure that out on a podcast.

00:37:24.400 –> 00:37:31.380
BREE NOBLE: And then I get content out of it instead of just going on a Zoom meeting and, you know, and just talking.

00:37:31.380 –> 00:37:39.640
BREE NOBLE: Doing a podcast lets me ask them any of the questions that I want to ask them, you know, within reason, obviously, because it’s public.

00:37:39.800 –> 00:37:53.920
BREE NOBLE: But so I can get to know them and their stance on things and the way that they do things, and see if that’s somebody I’d want to either, you know, work with in the future in some way.

00:37:53.920 –> 00:37:55.740
ROBONZO: That’s a really good point.

00:37:55.740 –> 00:38:09.220
ROBONZO: I don’t know if you recall, but I started out audio only, and only because of the dang pandemic and everyone’s, you know, I suddenly had to get off of Skype and be on Zoom and be on video for everyone.

00:38:09.660 –> 00:38:13.480
ROBONZO: But I’ve not really done a lot with video.

00:38:13.480 –> 00:38:23.800
ROBONZO: But boy, talk about an intimate medium, even with the video, but what an intimate medium to be able to talk to people like we are right now.

00:38:23.800 –> 00:38:27.860
ROBONZO: And I still believe that doing audio only is even more so.

00:38:27.860 –> 00:38:29.700
ROBONZO: And I don’t know what it is, but it is.

00:38:31.000 –> 00:38:42.080
ROBONZO: When I have a guest who is taking the opportunity seriously, because obviously with audio only, they can fidget around more if they want, but that doesn’t usually happen, but it has happened.

00:38:43.560 –> 00:38:45.040
BREE NOBLE: Yeah, I have.

00:38:45.040 –> 00:38:53.360
BREE NOBLE: Yeah, I do video, but I’ve had people that have treated video as if it was audio only and it was not good.

00:38:53.360 –> 00:38:56.360
BREE NOBLE: Like they just they weren’t thinking about what they were doing.

00:38:56.360 –> 00:38:57.860
BREE NOBLE: I’m like, I can’t air this.

00:38:57.860 –> 00:38:58.980
BREE NOBLE: This is you.

00:38:58.980 –> 00:39:04.040
BREE NOBLE: You’re like literally looking at your phone while we’re having this conversation.

00:39:04.040 –> 00:39:04.760
BREE NOBLE: That doesn’t work.

00:39:07.220 –> 00:39:07.860
ROBONZO: That’s been a challenge.

00:39:07.860 –> 00:39:10.460
ROBONZO: I was looking forward to speaking with you.

00:39:10.460 –> 00:39:17.060
ROBONZO: The fact that you and I were speaking for this episode because you are a podcaster and you know about doing good audio.

00:39:17.480 –> 00:39:21.940
ROBONZO: You know about what the ramifications of not doing decent video are.

00:39:21.940 –> 00:39:30.940
ROBONZO: I’ve been thinking about this a lot lately in terms of trying to keep a consistently better production value.

00:39:30.940 –> 00:39:33.180
ROBONZO: I’m trying to think of it from an evergreen standpoint.

00:39:36.480 –> 00:39:46.280
ROBONZO: Because in a large sense, podcasts have become so much more competitive and there are a lot of really high-end productions out there, many of which will be around for a while.

00:39:46.280 –> 00:39:53.460
ROBONZO: So I think it may matter and anyway, I’ve just been thinking about it like, okay, yeah, how do I do that?

00:39:54.420 –> 00:40:00.460
ROBONZO: Limit myself more who I talk to or do I need to look toward a day where I’m sending people gear?

00:40:00.460 –> 00:40:02.040
ROBONZO: Do I move to in-person only?

00:40:02.040 –> 00:40:05.140
ROBONZO: But all those things present challenges.

00:40:05.140 –> 00:40:07.140
BREE NOBLE: I mean, I totally agree with that.

00:40:07.140 –> 00:40:17.260
BREE NOBLE: But on the other side of that coin, I have also gone to the, if I don’t make it easy on myself, it’s not going to get done and I’m going to hate it.

00:40:17.260 –> 00:40:17.760
ROBONZO: Yeah.

00:40:17.760 –> 00:40:21.160
BREE NOBLE: So that’s why I don’t have a YouTube channel.

00:40:21.160 –> 00:40:21.940
BREE NOBLE: I have tried.

00:40:22.460 –> 00:40:31.140
BREE NOBLE: I just can’t deal with the editing and the polish and the, you know, the things that are required to have a good YouTube channel.

00:40:31.140 –> 00:40:37.120
BREE NOBLE: And so what I came to in myself is I’d rather keep podcasting.

00:40:37.120 –> 00:40:48.000
BREE NOBLE: And unless like something catastrophic happens, I’m not going to edit because I just, I want to have video and I don’t want to have to edit video.

00:40:48.000 –> 00:40:50.620
BREE NOBLE: That’s just way too labor intensive for me.

00:40:51.560 –> 00:40:53.720
BREE NOBLE: With everything else that I’m doing.

00:40:53.720 –> 00:40:55.440
BREE NOBLE: So I’ve just kind of made that decision.

00:40:55.440 –> 00:41:02.340
BREE NOBLE: And yes, my videos that are on YouTube, that are my long podcast videos, they don’t get a ton of views, right?

00:41:02.340 –> 00:41:04.700
BREE NOBLE: Because they’re not exciting and they don’t have jump cuts.

00:41:04.700 –> 00:41:07.100
BREE NOBLE: They, you know, and that’s okay.

00:41:07.100 –> 00:41:17.060
BREE NOBLE: I’ve just decided that that’s okay because I’d rather be able to put the content out there and connect with the people that really can use the content than worry about being perfect.

00:41:17.540 –> 00:41:18.020
ROBONZO: Sure.

00:41:18.020 –> 00:41:19.140
ROBONZO: Well, I wish I was more like you.

00:41:19.140 –> 00:41:27.420
ROBONZO: The editing thing has probably been my one curse and I’ve gone from, you know, having someone doing it and now I’m doing it myself again these days.

00:41:27.420 –> 00:41:32.480
ROBONZO: And that’s why I don’t do video because, yes, that’s another editing chore and a pretty big one at that.

00:41:32.480 –> 00:41:36.700
ROBONZO: But, you know, you probably know this, but it’s worth saying for people that are listening.

00:41:36.700 –> 00:41:47.320
ROBONZO: But with YouTube, most of us, most podcasters who have a YouTube channel or who are doing video of any kind are not going to get most of their listenership there.

00:41:47.320 –> 00:41:54.240
ROBONZO: But with YouTube specifically, it really is a good component for the discovery part of your podcast.

00:41:54.240 –> 00:42:10.040
ROBONZO: Because the fact of the matter is, is that if you’re doing anything that’s long form, you know, 20 minutes or more, unless they have a YouTube premium account, they’re not going to watch that, they’re probably not going to watch a lot of your episodes in their entire day.

00:42:10.040 –> 00:42:12.120
BREE NOBLE: There’s too many commercials, oh my gosh.

00:42:12.120 –> 00:42:14.860
BREE NOBLE: I try to watch things on YouTube and it drives me nuts.

00:42:14.860 –> 00:42:17.240
BREE NOBLE: There’s so many ads.

00:42:17.240 –> 00:42:25.300
BREE NOBLE: I would say though, like I said, I don’t get very many views on my long podcasts, like literally like 50 or less most of the time.

00:42:25.300 –> 00:42:25.840
BREE NOBLE: But-

00:42:25.840 –> 00:42:27.100
ROBONZO: And that’s not bad.

00:42:27.100 –> 00:42:27.840
BREE NOBLE: I guess.

00:42:27.840 –> 00:42:33.200
BREE NOBLE: But there are people that exclusively follow my podcast on YouTube, that’s it.

00:42:33.200 –> 00:42:34.540
BREE NOBLE: They’re not following it anywhere else.

00:42:35.060 –> 00:42:36.260
BREE NOBLE: I don’t even know if they’re watching.

00:42:36.260 –> 00:42:37.480
BREE NOBLE: Maybe they’re listening only.

00:42:37.480 –> 00:42:38.220
BREE NOBLE: That’s cool.

00:42:38.220 –> 00:42:40.500
BREE NOBLE: That’s how they consume.

00:42:40.500 –> 00:42:43.720
BREE NOBLE: But my shorts do way better.

00:42:43.720 –> 00:42:57.080
BREE NOBLE: So the reason I do video mostly is so I can do shorts, so I can do Instagram reels, TikTok, like all the stuff that I can grab from the episode, that you can’t if you don’t have video.

00:42:57.080 –> 00:42:57.300
ROBONZO: Yeah.

00:42:57.300 –> 00:43:06.000
ROBONZO: But I think that’s the big thing I have talked about, and we’ll stress in the whole podcast startup course I mentioned to use that video content.

00:43:06.000 –> 00:43:20.040
ROBONZO: I mean, there are a lot of different ways to approach video, and one of them is just including what you said, like I’m not going to do a full episode, but I’m going to use this video for some short content, and that can be very impactful as you just justified.

00:43:20.040 –> 00:43:20.820
BREE NOBLE: Yeah.

00:43:20.820 –> 00:43:21.980
BREE NOBLE: Yeah, for sure.

00:43:21.980 –> 00:43:23.200
ROBONZO: That’s great.

00:43:23.200 –> 00:43:23.480
ROBONZO: Okay.

00:43:23.480 –> 00:43:35.860
ROBONZO: So what practical advice would you give a musician or other creative, if they could only focus on one thing in the first 90 days to set themselves up for long term success with a podcast?

00:43:35.860 –> 00:43:37.300
BREE NOBLE: Oh, man.

00:43:37.300 –> 00:43:38.680
ROBONZO: That’s a tough question, isn’t it?

00:43:38.680 –> 00:43:40.520
BREE NOBLE: Yeah, that’s like a huge question.

00:43:41.600 –> 00:43:49.340
BREE NOBLE: I would say, I mean, things are so much easier now, honestly, with AI, right?

00:43:49.340 –> 00:43:56.800
BREE NOBLE: Just even coming up with a good solid set of interview questions would be so fast, right?

00:43:56.800 –> 00:44:13.080
BREE NOBLE: I remember listening to other podcasts and taking down questions that I liked, and coming up with this set of questions that again, I never look at anymore, but I did for the first year for sure, because it was nerve-wracking if I didn’t have questions in front of me.

00:44:13.080 –> 00:44:17.060
BREE NOBLE: So I would definitely come up with a good solid set of questions.

00:44:17.060 –> 00:44:22.340
BREE NOBLE: Try to come up with something interesting, like unique, not the same questions.

00:44:22.340 –> 00:44:29.080
BREE NOBLE: Obviously, you want to try to tailor the questions to the person that you’re talking to.

00:44:29.340 –> 00:44:38.220
BREE NOBLE: You know, now I read their bio, I ask them for talking points, and I tailor my questions to that for sure.

00:44:38.220 –> 00:44:41.240
BREE NOBLE: But when I first started, I did have a standard set of questions.

00:44:41.240 –> 00:44:44.120
BREE NOBLE: So make sure you have that because that will make it a lot easier.

00:44:44.120 –> 00:44:53.900
BREE NOBLE: You can totally go off the cuff, you can go on tangents, but having that one solid piece, if you’re doing interviews, you need to have that.

00:44:53.900 –> 00:45:03.640
BREE NOBLE: Also, this is a very simple thing, but let me tell you, if you don’t do it, it’s kind of a disaster or frustrating, is have a scheduler.

00:45:03.640 –> 00:45:13.800
BREE NOBLE: Because if you’re trying to figure out when they can meet and when you can meet and all that and you’re going back and forth, it’s awful.

00:45:13.800 –> 00:45:15.040
BREE NOBLE: Schedulers are free.

00:45:15.040 –> 00:45:20.420
BREE NOBLE: I use Acuity and it is still free, the version that I use.

00:45:20.420 –> 00:45:24.080
BREE NOBLE: And you can have them fill out forms, you can do all that stuff.

00:45:24.080 –> 00:45:26.340
BREE NOBLE: It makes your life so much easier.

00:45:26.560 –> 00:45:32.340
BREE NOBLE: So I feel like that’s the first thing someone should set up if they’re doing interviews is a scheduler.

00:45:32.340 –> 00:45:36.000
BREE NOBLE: Because otherwise, you’re going to tear your hair out for sure.

00:45:37.640 –> 00:45:51.480
BREE NOBLE: Now, if they’re not doing interviews, they’re doing a solo thing, I would just brainstorm using AI topics and get yourself some quick outlines at least.

00:45:51.480 –> 00:46:05.020
BREE NOBLE: If you’re really good at talking off the cuff, that’s cool, but you still want outlines because you don’t want to just go far afield, or you don’t want to run out of things to say or not have thought through that.

00:46:05.020 –> 00:46:13.420
BREE NOBLE: Even if you’re recording, when I first started, I was recording audio only, I was starting and stopping myself and just piecing it all together.

00:46:14.140 –> 00:46:15.820
BREE NOBLE: You can do that from the beginning.

00:46:15.820 –> 00:46:20.780
BREE NOBLE: Now, I just have an outline and go for it.

00:46:21.860 –> 00:46:24.260
BREE NOBLE: But that’s a skill that you develop.

00:46:24.260 –> 00:46:37.480
BREE NOBLE: So just having a structure, having a structure, whether it’s interviews or whether it’s your solo episodes is definitely going to make everything easier for you.

00:46:37.480 –> 00:46:38.760
ROBONZO: Super good advice.

00:46:38.760 –> 00:47:01.180
ROBONZO: I was thinking, I knew I’d probably mention this because we would talk about AI, and it has made, I mean, God, if you knew how much time I spent trying to come up with a title and write an episode description and piece of cake now, but it has made so many facets of it easier, even without spending any money for sophisticated tools.

00:47:01.180 –> 00:47:10.860
ROBONZO: But it also enables you to reach farther and do more, just be more, you know, air quotes productive toward meeting whatever goals you have for your podcast.

00:47:10.860 –> 00:47:32.600
ROBONZO: So in one sense, it has really made a lot of tasks easier, but it’s empowering us to do more and just keep ourselves, maybe all the much more busier or as busy as we were, unless we were just trying to get this one thing done and the aspirational runway is, it’s already set and then man, yeah, it’s just made your life a lot easier.

00:47:33.820 –> 00:47:34.260
BREE NOBLE: Yeah.

00:47:34.260 –> 00:47:44.640
BREE NOBLE: I mean, I used to actually have a VA service that did all the back end stuff for me, and I don’t need that anymore.

00:47:44.640 –> 00:47:51.800
BREE NOBLE: I can just stick it into Cast Magic and it will give me the transcript and it will give me a summary and give me a YouTube description and title.

00:47:52.740 –> 00:47:55.100
BREE NOBLE: It gives you a lot of titles to choose from.

00:47:55.100 –> 00:47:58.740
BREE NOBLE: I usually amalgam a few that they have.

00:47:58.740 –> 00:48:03.660
BREE NOBLE: Their ones are never like my perfect title, but it’s so much easier.

00:48:03.660 –> 00:48:09.200
BREE NOBLE: I can do that now post production right after I finish my interview.

00:48:09.200 –> 00:48:13.160
BREE NOBLE: I immediately stick it into Cast Magic, pull all that stuff out.

00:48:13.160 –> 00:48:18.160
BREE NOBLE: I’ve got everything I need now to put it in my newsletter, to put it on YouTube.

00:48:18.160 –> 00:48:20.980
BREE NOBLE: Like I can just get all that done.

00:48:20.980 –> 00:48:27.340
BREE NOBLE: And so it’s done in advance, which to me is the best thing about having AI.

00:48:27.340 –> 00:48:34.040
BREE NOBLE: When the podcast comes out, like I’m literally like, oh, it’s, you know, Rabanzo’s episode this week.

00:48:34.040 –> 00:48:37.840
BREE NOBLE: I didn’t realize, because I’d already done everything on the back end for it.

00:48:37.840 –> 00:48:39.960
BREE NOBLE: And when it comes out, I’m like, oh, let me let him know.

00:48:39.960 –> 00:48:43.740
BREE NOBLE: Here’s his assets, you know, but everything else is already done.

00:48:43.740 –> 00:48:44.600
ROBONZO: That’s great.

00:48:44.600 –> 00:48:45.820
ROBONZO: Yeah.

00:48:45.820 –> 00:48:46.540
ROBONZO: Handy tools.

00:48:46.540 –> 00:48:49.860
ROBONZO: It’s changing our lives.

00:48:49.860 –> 00:48:51.180
BREE NOBLE: Yes.

00:48:51.180 –> 00:49:02.420
ROBONZO: Okay, so my last one on this list, although you had me open this file, this text document I have on a list, a long list of just questions.

00:49:03.740 –> 00:49:04.540
ROBONZO: You may get another one.

00:49:04.660 –> 00:49:07.340
ROBONZO: You know, these ones that really catch my eye and get me thinking.

00:49:07.340 –> 00:49:17.360
ROBONZO: But anyway, the last one I had planned was, given how the podcasting landscape has evolved since you started and you have been doing it for a while, even I guess I could say the same for myself.

00:49:17.720 –> 00:49:31.260
ROBONZO: What advice would you give to creatives and musicians starting podcasts this year in 2025 that might be different from what worked five or maybe ten years ago?

00:49:31.260 –> 00:49:45.560
BREE NOBLE: I think doing podcasts, swaps, feed swaps, collab episodes, I think that might be something that’s really working right now.

00:49:46.820 –> 00:49:52.280
BREE NOBLE: Because I know that I’m not out there looking for new podcasts.

00:49:52.280 –> 00:50:01.060
BREE NOBLE: As someone who loves podcasts, who listens to them every day, I’ve got enough in my queue, but sometimes I get sick of the ones that I have.

00:50:01.060 –> 00:50:23.420
BREE NOBLE: So what tends to happen to me is I’m listening to another podcast, I hear a really good guest, or I hear someone who’s doing a collab episode, or I hear someone who’s doing a feed swap, which means that they put one of their episodes, it’s like a takeover, they put one of their episodes on that person’s feed that’s introduced by that person, so it’s not just randomly thrown there.

00:50:23.520 –> 00:50:28.940
BREE NOBLE: It’s like, hey, this is my friend, this person, and she’s going to talk about this, because I know this is helpful to you.

00:50:28.940 –> 00:50:32.500
BREE NOBLE: I’ve found some of my new favorite podcasts that way.

00:50:32.500 –> 00:50:45.020
BREE NOBLE: So I think it might not be as much about going into Spotify or into Apple and searching for podcasts about a certain subject, although people do do that.

00:50:45.020 –> 00:50:52.160
BREE NOBLE: A lot of times you find podfaded podcasts, which is really frustrating because the podcast looks super exciting, and then you’re like, oh, their last episode was in 2022.

00:50:53.740 –> 00:50:59.280
BREE NOBLE: So I have been just finding a lot of new episodes that way organically.

00:50:59.280 –> 00:51:16.100
BREE NOBLE: So I think that’s one reason I think that my friend and I are doing collabs on each other’s feeds, because then we do this one thing that is like basically half the work because we’re doing it together, and then we both have an episode.

00:51:16.100 –> 00:51:19.780
BREE NOBLE: Then we’re introducing each other to each other’s audiences.

00:51:19.920 –> 00:51:24.100
BREE NOBLE: Our audiences are very well aligned, very same type of people.

00:51:24.100 –> 00:51:27.500
BREE NOBLE: And so we know we’re doing a service for the audience too.

00:51:27.500 –> 00:51:29.160
ROBONZO: That’s cool.

00:51:29.160 –> 00:51:29.980
ROBONZO: That’s very cool.

00:51:29.980 –> 00:51:42.460
ROBONZO: I wonder if that is a somewhat stronger practice among female podcasters as opposed to the guys.

00:51:42.460 –> 00:51:44.300
BREE NOBLE: It’s possible.

00:51:44.300 –> 00:51:46.360
BREE NOBLE: I feel like women are very collaborative.

00:51:46.360 –> 00:51:48.480
BREE NOBLE: Sometimes men are very siloed, you know.

00:51:49.340 –> 00:51:51.800
BREE NOBLE: Although you’re not that way, but I mean, and there are plenty of men.

00:51:51.800 –> 00:51:58.520
BREE NOBLE: I know that I think I met you because I was introduced to you by, I think, D.

00:51:58.520 –> 00:52:00.160
BREE NOBLE: Grant Smith, maybe.

00:52:00.160 –> 00:52:01.320
ROBONZO: Could have been, yep.

00:52:01.320 –> 00:52:03.740
BREE NOBLE: You know, someone like, you guys are not siloed.

00:52:03.740 –> 00:52:07.200
BREE NOBLE: Like, you know, he’s always introducing me to people.

00:52:07.200 –> 00:52:13.060
BREE NOBLE: But I think that you’re right, that women just, it feels good to collaborate.

00:52:13.180 –> 00:52:17.400
BREE NOBLE: I love doing something that doesn’t have to be all me.

00:52:17.940 –> 00:52:22.920
ROBONZO: That would probably be a great way for me to get more female guests on the podcast, is to see if they want to collaborate.

00:52:22.920 –> 00:52:24.220
BREE NOBLE: There you go.

00:52:25.760 –> 00:52:43.600
ROBONZO: Being approached, I guess, by less female artists and, yeah, you always want to, I don’t know if you feel this way, but I always want to have a diverse number of voices on the podcast, be it more women, more people of color.

00:52:46.120 –> 00:52:50.400
ROBONZO: Sometimes I feel like I need to go out of my way more, that they don’t seek me out.

00:52:50.400 –> 00:52:55.520
ROBONZO: That may be because they see a bunch of whatever white dudes on here, and the occasional female, I don’t know.

00:52:55.520 –> 00:53:03.140
ROBONZO: Or it could be the nature of the artists that I have on, and I need to maybe be more genre.

00:53:03.140 –> 00:53:05.920
ROBONZO: It’s by no specific effort of mine.

00:53:05.920 –> 00:53:09.580
ROBONZO: I mean, if it was up to me, I’d be talking to a lot more like rock bands.

00:53:11.460 –> 00:53:18.360
ROBONZO: But I just, by nature, I don’t know, by nature of the podcast, or maybe just the whole folk singer-songwriter thing.

00:53:20.660 –> 00:53:26.680
BREE NOBLE: I think bands are less likely to seek out podcasting as a way to promote themselves anyway.

00:53:26.680 –> 00:53:29.060
BREE NOBLE: I can’t think of the last time I was approached by a band.

00:53:29.060 –> 00:53:37.720
BREE NOBLE: It’s mostly solo artists or duos, like you said, folk singer-songwriter, pop.

00:53:37.720 –> 00:53:39.820
BREE NOBLE: Definitely, I get pop people.

00:53:39.820 –> 00:53:44.060
BREE NOBLE: Obviously, for me, I don’t have the problem of having diversity between men and women.

00:53:44.060 –> 00:53:47.600
BREE NOBLE: I have plenty of women on my podcast.

00:53:48.940 –> 00:53:55.320
BREE NOBLE: And I think we’ve done pretty well with diversity, racial and cultural diversity.

00:53:55.320 –> 00:54:00.840
BREE NOBLE: But some of it is, I’ll be honest, some of it is just who approaches me, right?

00:54:00.840 –> 00:54:04.420
BREE NOBLE: Sometimes I’m busy, and I don’t have time to like seeking people out.

00:54:04.420 –> 00:54:17.500
BREE NOBLE: Now, recently, I did use AI to create myself a nice big list of people that I think that it thinks are very well aligned with the show, and I need to go through and see like, hey, have I had these people?

00:54:17.500 –> 00:54:20.240
BREE NOBLE: A lot of them I have had on there.

00:54:20.240 –> 00:54:22.280
BREE NOBLE: But a lot of them, I didn’t know who they were.

00:54:22.280 –> 00:54:24.980
ROBONZO: So, yeah, that’s a good idea.

00:54:26.380 –> 00:54:28.500
ROBONZO: I did something somewhat similar.

00:54:28.500 –> 00:54:29.840
ROBONZO: I had my AI buddy.

00:54:31.260 –> 00:54:42.800
ROBONZO: You know, I had a conversation about like, if I were to start mining the outside, external world for guests, now that you know what you know about the podcast, what do you recommend?

00:54:42.800 –> 00:54:43.800
ROBONZO: Where do you recommend I go?

00:54:43.800 –> 00:54:53.220
ROBONZO: So I have, it’s actually a very recent sort of project on my list to start looking at these avenues for the type of guests that I’m interested in.

00:54:53.220 –> 00:54:54.420
ROBONZO: So hopefully, that will be of help.

00:54:54.420 –> 00:54:55.340
ROBONZO: But it will be work, you know?

00:54:55.340 –> 00:55:03.900
ROBONZO: I mean, I guess I could have just said, hey, find me, give me some recommendations of guests that meet these criteria, that’s certainly another approach and arguably easier.

00:55:03.900 –> 00:55:07.860
BREE NOBLE: Yeah, and of course, we can always just reach out to other people in the end.

00:55:07.860 –> 00:55:15.720
BREE NOBLE: You know, I can, anytime I want, I could reach out to my guests, any of the guests that I really liked and say, hey, do you have anyone?

00:55:15.720 –> 00:55:18.580
BREE NOBLE: Especially if they’re podcasters, right?

00:55:18.580 –> 00:55:25.840
BREE NOBLE: You know, if they’re podcasters, they know plenty of people that if I say like, hey, I really want someone to come on and talk about YouTube, can you recommend somebody?

00:55:27.880 –> 00:55:31.740
BREE NOBLE: And that’s how I’ve found people that I wanted to talk on a specific subject.

00:55:31.740 –> 00:55:33.720
ROBONZO: That’s a good approach, very good approach.

00:55:33.720 –> 00:55:36.880
ROBONZO: Well, Bree, I think we did it.

00:55:36.880 –> 00:55:40.120
ROBONZO: It should be a great start to a little mini series I’m doing.

00:55:40.120 –> 00:55:44.460
ROBONZO: Did you, I know I did kind of most of the asking.

00:55:44.460 –> 00:55:47.140
BREE NOBLE: I just wanted to know why you started your podcast.

00:55:47.140 –> 00:55:48.740
BREE NOBLE: I didn’t get to ask.

00:55:48.740 –> 00:55:51.760
ROBONZO: Because Chris Ducker told me I needed one.

00:55:51.760 –> 00:55:53.500
BREE NOBLE: Because Chris Ducker told you?

00:55:54.700 –> 00:55:57.040
BREE NOBLE: Were you a euprenuer?

00:55:57.040 –> 00:56:02.980
ROBONZO: Yeah, I had written a book.

00:56:02.980 –> 00:56:08.380
BREE NOBLE: So it was because of the book, and he thought that would be a good way to get yourself out there.

00:56:08.380 –> 00:56:10.560
ROBONZO: Yeah, he was like, you need a podcast for Baritone.

00:56:10.560 –> 00:56:12.280
ROBONZO: I can hear his voice.

00:56:14.780 –> 00:56:24.640
ROBONZO: But it was a really wonderful discovery, and I’m glad he encouraged me because it really opened my eyes to all these different things in music that I didn’t know about.

00:56:26.380 –> 00:56:32.360
ROBONZO: I don’t find it all great, all the changes that have happened in the industry, but it certainly leaves no shortage of things to learn about.

00:56:32.360 –> 00:56:33.300
BREE NOBLE: That’s true.

00:56:33.640 –> 00:56:53.220
ROBONZO: The other things we’ve talked about like relationships and things like that, and like with the book, I was trying to help people and the podcast and the newsletter are all about helping musicians that are at a specific point in their journey and just trying to make things better.

00:56:53.220 –> 00:57:04.300
ROBONZO: I think there’s so many people, so many musicians out there right now with that too, because things are ever changing and it’s not easy to find the fulfillment that you want and make some money and all that good stuff.

00:57:04.300 –> 00:57:04.700
BREE NOBLE: Yeah.

00:57:06.320 –> 00:57:09.020
BREE NOBLE: Have you monetized your podcast in any way?

00:57:09.020 –> 00:57:13.300
ROBONZO: Yeah, but I wouldn’t say it’s a legitimate source of income.

00:57:13.300 –> 00:57:25.500
ROBONZO: It’s very sporadic and so I’m trying to be, you know, I’ve had some sponsors, donations, sales of paid newsletter which is kind of an extension of the podcast.

00:57:25.500 –> 00:57:28.540
ROBONZO: And then this course, the first that I’ve done.

00:57:28.540 –> 00:57:40.540
ROBONZO: So yeah, I’m going to focus on this and the things that I have established and work on the monetization part just to, yeah, keep it, keep the lights on, so to speak.

00:57:41.220 –> 00:57:42.260
BREE NOBLE: For sure.

00:57:42.260 –> 00:57:46.800
BREE NOBLE: I’m curious, has podcasting ever felt like a burden to you?

00:57:46.800 –> 00:57:48.640
ROBONZO: Sure.

00:57:48.640 –> 00:57:49.920
BREE NOBLE: Let’s be honest, yes.

00:57:50.080 –> 00:57:54.600
ROBONZO: Yeah, I mean, you know, you were talking about the, you know, the self-imposed pressure.

00:57:54.600 –> 00:58:04.220
ROBONZO: But today, well, two things about today, like I’ve never, no, I shouldn’t say never, but I’ve never on purpose said, you know what, I’m just going to publish this episode tomorrow.

00:58:04.260 –> 00:58:05.780
ROBONZO: It’s, it’s drop day.

00:58:05.780 –> 00:58:10.740
ROBONZO: But I literally start getting worried at two minutes past the schedule time.

00:58:10.740 –> 00:58:13.360
ROBONZO: And I’m like, huh, you know, it’s so funny.

00:58:13.360 –> 00:58:15.320
ROBONZO: I didn’t even think about the normal thing.

00:58:15.320 –> 00:58:21.800
ROBONZO: I would always think about, I need a backup plan for this because maybe something happened and she can’t make it today.

00:58:21.800 –> 00:58:22.320
BREE NOBLE: Right?

00:58:22.320 –> 00:58:30.620
BREE NOBLE: No, seriously, you never, I’ve definitely had some people that are like, I am so sorry, but like, I have a family emergency.

00:58:30.620 –> 00:58:32.980
BREE NOBLE: My daughter’s in the hospital or, you know, whatever it is.

00:58:35.320 –> 00:58:40.640
ROBONZO: Do you ever ask yourself like how many times, how long am I going to have to do this before I learn that lesson?

00:58:42.980 –> 00:58:45.780
BREE NOBLE: No, because I’m very far ahead thing.

00:58:45.940 –> 00:58:51.640
BREE NOBLE: I try to be at least a month, if not, there was a period there that I was at least three months ahead.

00:58:51.640 –> 00:59:00.520
BREE NOBLE: Then I feel kind of bad because I’m like, when people approach me, I’m like, yeah, you sound like a really good guest, but just so you know, your episode won’t come out until December.

00:59:00.520 –> 00:59:01.720
BREE NOBLE: Do you still want to come on the show?

00:59:02.900 –> 00:59:04.180
ROBONZO: Yeah, I’ve been there.

00:59:04.180 –> 00:59:10.960
ROBONZO: I don’t do so many interviews nowadays that I have that lovely problem.

00:59:10.960 –> 00:59:19.760
ROBONZO: But I do plan ahead, but it’s just so funny that I did what I did today because if something would have happened and you wouldn’t have been on, I’d have been like, well, we’ll see if I can still get one out tomorrow.

00:59:19.760 –> 00:59:24.300
ROBONZO: But I do have something that was already planned, but it’s not built out yet.

00:59:24.360 –> 00:59:26.200
ROBONZO: I would have got to record it and outline it.

00:59:26.200 –> 00:59:30.020
BREE NOBLE: I probably scared you when I was five minutes late because I lost track of time.

00:59:30.400 –> 00:59:30.960
ROBONZO: No.

00:59:31.180 –> 00:59:39.080
ROBONZO: I honestly have gotten to a point where nobody is going to freak out if this doesn’t come out until Saturday or Monday or even Tuesday.

00:59:41.220 –> 00:59:41.840
ROBONZO: So that’s good.

00:59:41.840 –> 00:59:42.980
BREE NOBLE: But I will be on.

00:59:42.980 –> 00:59:47.860
BREE NOBLE: I am someone that listens to podcasts, and I know the days of the week they come out.

00:59:48.640 –> 01:00:01.080
BREE NOBLE: I might not notice it right away, but if it’s like Thursday, and I know that a certain podcast comes out on Tuesday, I might not notice it right away on Tuesday, but by Thursday, I’ll be like, hey, where is that episode?

01:00:01.080 –> 01:00:01.820
BREE NOBLE: It’s not there.

01:00:01.960 –> 01:00:03.320
BREE NOBLE: What happened to it?

01:00:03.320 –> 01:00:03.820
ROBONZO: Yeah.

01:00:03.820 –> 01:00:12.680
ROBONZO: Well, I’m sure it’s a product of listenership in terms of number of downloads, but no one’s ever called me out on it like, hey, I noticed you didn’t drop on Friday.

01:00:12.680 –> 01:00:13.220
BREE NOBLE: I agree.

01:00:13.220 –> 01:00:14.820
BREE NOBLE: I’ve never had that happen either.

01:00:14.820 –> 01:00:18.680
BREE NOBLE: It’s just more my internal type A personality.

01:00:19.060 –> 01:00:20.320
ROBONZO: Totally.

01:00:20.320 –> 01:00:22.900
ROBONZO: Well, as per usual, thank you.

01:00:22.900 –> 01:00:26.060
ROBONZO: Well, I was going to say as per usual, I’ll send you all the goodies about this episode.

01:00:26.060 –> 01:00:29.720
ROBONZO: And if there’s anything you need from me, please don’t hesitate.

01:00:29.720 –> 01:00:31.220
ROBONZO: I’m glad that we reconnected.

01:00:31.220 –> 01:00:35.920
BREE NOBLE: I’m glad I offered to talk instead of write all that stuff out.

01:00:35.920 –> 01:00:37.920
BREE NOBLE: It’s much more fun for me.

01:00:37.920 –> 01:00:38.160
ROBONZO: Good.

01:00:38.160 –> 01:00:39.140
ROBONZO: I’m glad you enjoyed it.

01:00:39.140 –> 01:00:44.340
ROBONZO: I think it’s going to be a super valuable conversation, and it was a real joy to speak with you again.

01:00:44.340 –> 01:00:47.520
BREE NOBLE: So can you send me the recording and then I can put it on?

01:00:47.700 –> 01:00:49.180
BREE NOBLE: I definitely want to put it on my feed.

01:00:49.180 –> 01:00:50.280
BREE NOBLE: I think that’ll be cool.

01:00:50.280 –> 01:00:52.120
ROBONZO: I sure will.

01:00:52.120 –> 01:00:53.300
BREE NOBLE: Awesome.

01:00:53.300 –> 01:00:53.720
ROBONZO: Cool.

01:00:53.720 –> 01:00:54.300
ROBONZO: All right.

01:00:54.300 –> 01:00:54.920
ROBONZO: Thanks, Bree.

01:00:54.920 –> 01:00:55.680
BREE NOBLE: Okay.

01:00:55.680 –> 01:00:56.920
BREE NOBLE: Happy editing.

01:00:56.920 –> 01:00:57.300
ROBONZO: Thank you.

01:00:57.300 –> 01:00:58.800
ROBONZO: I’ll talk to you soon.

01:00:59.980 –> 01:01:00.980
BREE NOBLE: Have a good day.

01:01:00.980 –> 01:01:01.300
ROBONZO: You too.

01:01:01.300 –> 01:01:01.960
ROBONZO: Bye-bye.

01:01:01.960 –> 01:01:03.240
BREE NOBLE: Bye.

01:01:03.240 –> 01:01:06.140
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01:01:06.140 –> 01:01:08.180
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01:01:08.180 –> 01:01:11.020
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01:01:11.020 –> 01:01:22.700
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01:01:22.700 –> 01:01:25.020
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01:01:25.020 –> 01:01:28.280
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01:01:28.280 –> 01:01:40.040
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01:01:40.040 –> 01:01:43.800
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01:01:55.560 –> 01:01:59.860
ROBONZO: The music you’re hearing is New God’s Part 2, the instrumental mix by yours truly.

01:01:59.860 –> 01:02:15.380
ROBONZO: You can hear the full version downloaded or buy it at rabonzo.com and if all this was too much to remember or process, just go to the show notes for this episode at unstarvingmusician.com to find links to all the stuff, talked about in this episode.

01:02:15.380 –> 01:02:19.480
ROBONZO: You can leave us feedback, questions, comments, complaints at unstarvingmusician.com/feedback.

01:02:22.000 –> 01:02:25.580
ROBONZO: Thanks for listening, peace, gratitude and a whole lot of love.